Brandon a local Democrat stopped by and very eloquently provided a rebuttal to some of my post. I am going to take up the challenge and continue the debate, for now!
Arab Dominoes are falling. Can you hear them?, I had posted: This is no surprise to me or anybody else that knew that the WMDs were secondary issue, but an important one to bring along the stupid masses of America.
Brandon said: Lying about WMD's and scaring the public is simply unacceptable, period. Your post is so quick to trumpet Republican triumphs (bringing down the Berlin wall and removing Saddam) but you gloss over the WMD issue as if it doesn't matter.
I respond: Who lied? Bush didn’t lie! Kerry didn’t lie! Kennedy didn’t lie and neither did the Clintons! WMDs were either moved, are still there hidden or everyone was mistaken about the stockpiles. NOBODY was mistaken about Saddam’s ability to make and then use WMDs.
Brandon said: The lie that Bush and his administration told was much more serious than Clinton's Monica fiasco and Clinton was impeached... Bush should be impeached as well.
I responded: Clinton committed a FELONY by lying under oath about his sexual harassment and adultery committed in the OVAL office. Bush didn’t lie! You really should read the Iraq War Resolution, WMDs are one of many issues.
Brandon said: The Bush administration didn't just make comments they actually made war (one that many people say was illegal). The Bush administration went to the international forum and lied about WMD's not any US congressman (Democrat or Republican).
I responded: No lie, no foul! Illegal War? We just continued the First Gulf War, Saddam and the USA never signed a Peace Treaty! What ‘international forum”? Just use the two letters that indicate corruption and appeasement...UN! Can we say “Oil for Food Scandal”, “Rwanda” or the “Congo”?
Brandon said: Bush actually did things that he should get impeached for. What did anyone outside of his administration actually do (not just say)?
I responded: What did he do? Or is it just what you think he did or what the DEMons say he did? Everyone else that was conservative supported Bush and the non-supporters obstructed him or maybe I find the whole question absurd!
Diversity? Poor vs Rich?, I had posted: What does Diversity mean? What is it's root? Division, differences and divisiveness? This is not a mistake! The Democrats really on it. By accentuating our differences, they create envy and hate, core values of the Democrats. Without envy and hate, their whole existence would be in question.
Brandon said: You are correct, if there were no envy and hate then there would be no Democrats... only because there would be no need for them as there would be no Republicans. We all know the Republican Party is generally the homophobic party, there's no point in trying to deny that. Note: I'm not saying that all Republicans are homophobic.IIRC Lyndon Johnson said the South would continue to vote Republican, no matter how much their economic policies drove them deeper into debt, because of the race issue. Interestingly enough, the absolute poorest states in the union (all in the South BTW) voted Republican.
I respond: We have a two party system, so regardless of the issues there will always be two Parties. You seem to imply that the Hate and Envy is the fault of the Republican, while I contend that the Hate and Envy is fostered and created by the Democrats to justify their existence, to further their agenda and to ensure their voter base remains Democrats. Instead of celebrating the commonalities of the differing races and bringing them closer together like the Republicans advocate, the Democrats create and drive wedges between us. To Republicans, a poor minority child is no needier than a poor white child, but to the Democrats there is a difference and it is race.
Brandon said: For you to say that Democrats feed on envy and hate is simply ridiculous considering how much Republicans in many parts of the country absolutely fear any kind of influence from the coasts (a.k.a liberal influence). Not only that, because it's one thing to not want any outside influences in your own community, but many right-wingers don't want anyone, anywhere, to accept things that right wingers typically hate.
I responded: Republicans have seen the damage done to American society by the Liberals of the coasts. With the Liberals, morals, ethics and values take a back seat to personal desires and depravity. It seems with the coastal morons, the more depraved the desire the better. Democrats promote and feed on envy and hate, to keep minorities in their camp. Democrats use minorities to maintain power, while the “Evil” Republican treat minorities as equals and join with them to make America better place, (Rice, Powell, Gonzales and hundreds more). Ask yourself, How many minorities held cabinet positions in Clinton’s administration? None, Zero, Zilch.
Brandon said: Take for instance the gay marriage issue. While both Bush and Kerry are against it, only Bush wants a national ban on it. Bush's national ban basically let's the large amount of people in the heartland and the south decide what goes on in California (or other places). Even if every single person in California voted for gay marriage, it would be in vein because people in places like Alabama are homophobic and scared shitless that it'll encourage people to be gay (particularly their own sons and daughters) if gay people are allowed to marry. That's hate mongering and right-wingers are notorious for it to deny that simply damages your credibility.
I responded: Homosexuality is a disease much like alcoholism and other addictions. It is a choice and it is NOT normal. No one has every proven a Gay is born that way, no one! This Gay Marriage thing is a bid to be labeled “Normal” during the distraction of a War. Not only is that deceitful it is un-American. Homosexuals have been offered the Civil Union for years and it bestows everything a marriage does except the label of normal. Your ideas of why most people oppose Gay Marriages are indications of the level of Democratic/Liberal/College dogma you have absorbed as truth.
Brandon said: That's hate mongering and right-wingers are notorious for it to deny that simply damages your credibility.
I responded: I had to respond to this Bullshit separately. The hate you feel is your own. Conservatives give more to charity, volunteer more, attend religious services more and love their fellow man more than you will ever know as a liberal! Conservatives respond to the Left’s rabid hatred with civility and maturity. A striking example is the difference in the behavior of the Liberal protestors at the RNC and the Conservative protestors at the DNC. Your ideology has No credibility and you are in denial of the true nature of the Left!
Brandon said: You can talk about Democrats feeding on envy and hate but it's really easy to see that all the bible belt fanatics, KKK, Neo-Nazi, Aryan Nation (sp?), and Anti-Semitic groups in this country supported Bush-- think about that.
I responded: You spit out, “bible belt fanatics” like they are terrorists! Then you speak of the “KKK, Neo-Nazi, Aryan Nation (sp?), and Anti-Semitic groups” in the same breath and as if these group have large numbers and actually influence the Republican Party. Are you really that delusional? For those groups, ‘their enemy’s enemy is their friend’. The Republican Party rejects these groups and their ideals.
However the Democratic Party embraces, Anarchists, Communists, Socialists, Nihilists, Eco-Terrorists, Satanists, Racists(Anti-Free trade for example) and Anti-American groups of every stripe. They are all one big tent!
The Republican Party is THE biggest supporter of Israel. Democrats/Liberals support the PLO. So who is an anti-Semite? Who is deluding themselves? Indy Media has members that openly support the Palestinians and they hold rallies and vigils all over the country to show that support. Not one of those people voted for Bush! Not one! American liberal’s biggest heroes; the Socialist Europeans have once again made anti-Semitism in-vogue, a political fact and a political asset. The “KKK, Neo-Nazi, Aryan Nation (sp?), and Anti-Semitic groups” are fringe groups that have never been courted by the Republicans. The Democrats have courted and continue to court groups, like the members of the Indy Media, and by doing so have endorsed main stream liberal anti-Semitism.
I had posted: So you have to ask yourself what the rich Democrats that populate the Congress, like Kennedy, Kerry, Dayton and Edwards get by serving in public office? Supposedly promoting causes that in effect depletes their own wealth. It sure isn't to help the poor and disadvantaged! Their wealth is protected in shelters and loop holes they have created in the tax system they have created. The only people taxed are those earning income and without enough wealth to protect that income. Kennedy, Kerry, Dayton and Edwards do not pay taxes, they are too rich to pay taxes.
Brandon said: A stroll past factcheck.com wouldn't hurt you once and a while.
I responded: Do you mean factcheck.org? I might as well get my info from the DNC! The site is funded by George “Heroin” Soros and staffed by liberal hacks!
Brandon said: If you remember back to the elections you'll come across Kerry and Edwards wanting to increase taxes for the rich by repealing Bush's tax cut for the rich. Again, this is just you being selectively blind. Bush gave the rich the gigantic tax cut and when Kerry threatened to take it away from just the rich (people who make more than 200,000 per year), it was Bush trying to deceive the whole American public into thinking Kerry was going to take away everyone's tax cut.
I responded: Kerry and Edwards have already made sure that they can hide assets, use shelters and other means to protect their money from any cut or rise in taxes. Besides the fact that income taxes are illegal according to the Constitution, taxing anybody at a higher rate for any reason is discrimination, so it is also illegal. I am not a rich person and I didn’t get a tax cut. But those I know that got their taxes cut work hard for their money. I resent you liberals for thinking that you have a right to tax anybody at a different rate than you would apply to everyone. The guy making $200,000 doesn’t make enough money to hide and cheat to protect his money like Edwards and Kerry can and do!
I had posted: The Democrats in Minnesota today aren't liberals. They are conservatives that are unionists, hate the rich and want the government to help the poor. They give reasons for voting Democrat like, "I have always vote Democrat!" or "Back in the 20's they made us vote Republican to keep our jobs!". One reason shows a closed mind and the other references in incident 85 years ago.
Brandon said: I live in Bloomington, MN and I've heard a lot of people (both Democrat and Republican) say they vote the way they do because they or their family has always done so but I have never ever heard anyone mention anything in the 20's. I'm not sure what 3 people you surveyed but that is hardly a popular reason for voting democrat in MN.
I responded: I am not sure what to say, except to reiterate that I think most Minnesota Democrats are hypocrites. Not every Republican is smart and open minded, but no Democrat is smart and open minded. If they were they would be a Republican!
I had posted: If most of Minnesota's Democrats really were aware of sewer of ideals the Democratic Party has become they would flee it for the Republican Party. The true Party of the People!
Brandon said: Your logic is failing here. Let's say that Minnesota Democrats found out that Kerry, Edwards, and all the other Democrats were actually closet racists. Then why would they flee to a party that they already know is full of racists, hate mongers, and homophobes (the Republicans)? That would be like trading one demon for another. If anything, people would head to other liberal parties.
I responded: You have a foolish and ignorant idea of what the Republicans are and stand for. I know the Democrats are the real Party full of racists, hate mongers, and homophobes. I see it in their propaganda and on their websites. The Republicans I know are warm, religious, kind people that love their country. The Republican Party reflects that! We do NOT believe the government should be the answer to all of life’s problems and that a person is responsible for their own happiness! We will always freely help the disabled, but expect the able to take care of themselves.
"Hate" by pntblank, I had posted: You all like that crap, so why don't you all go to Sweden or France or anywhere they have socialism already going strong and bankrupting the country. None of you can see the danger in that kind of government and it proves just how stupid you really are.
Brandon said: That's one of the dumbest comments I've ever heard. Saying Socialism is dangerous because it's bankrupting France and Sweden is akin to saying Capitalism is dangerous because it bankrupted Argentina, Brazil, and Guatemala.
I responded: Socialism is the antithesis of Capitalism. Capitalism is what made this country great. We were great before FDR, the New Deal, Social Security and Welfare. None of this stuff made us great, it is Socialism and has in fact reduced our potential. Socialism is dangerous because it attacks Capitalism, excellence, opportunity and achievement. Socialism endorses mediocrity, lowest common denominator and dumbing down. Socialism is nothing short of Communism Lite. I have yet to investigate Brandon’s claims that Capitalism alone, bankrupted Argentina, Brazil, and Guatemala. I suspect I will find rampant corruption and greed at the heart of their downfall.
What has this exercise shown me? Well, nothing! That’s not really true. Like most Liberals, Brandon is steeped and brewed heavily in the lies and misinformation liberals use to hide their true ideals and goals. Brandon has allowed himself to be sucked into their view of the world as an evil place full of bad people. Brandon’s age has some part in this, but I know elderly liberals living fat and happy that also have this demented view of the world.
I, and most conservatives, have a much more hopeful view of the world and people in general. We know people generally want to do the right thing. We trust that the good people will outweigh the evil, and that good will prevail over evil. Conservatives, know you have to stand up to and fight some things. We also think a person should strive to be better and succeed on their own merits and not be handed opportunities based on race, creed, religion or any other reason not applicable to all Americans.
I have hope, Brandon. Hope for a better world. Hope for a more color blind world. Hope for a more freer world. Hope for a more peaceful world.
Brandon, you live in a world full of envy and desire. A world full of lies and fear. You accept this world because it is what you want to hear and you feel better because you hear it! Your failures are not your fault, some evil person has made you fail. Your problems are caused by others, not you. You liberals have created a fall guy, demonized him to be forever your enemy and your nemesis. That fall guy is me and every other conservative. I will not wear your label. It is not me!